Saturday, 14 November 2009

Some info for Rivero - Dresden's Nazism

"Every year on February 13th and 14th, Germans commemorate the bombing of Dresden by the allied forces in 1945.

Usually there is an official memorial at the ‘Heidefriedhof’, a cemetery in the outskirts of Dresden. This year on February 13th , Dresden’s mayor Helga Orosz and Saxony’s prime minister Stanislaw Tillich spoke to the 200 mourners and laid a wreath in commemoration of the dead. Like in the years before, this event was also attended by several neo-Nazis, for example by members of the NPD, the main far right party, and of the neo-Nazi organisation HDJ.

In the evening of Friday February 13th, around 2500 people gathered around the ‘Frauenkirche’ (‘church of our lady’) – which was burned out during the bombing and collapsed – to remember the people who died during the bombing. Around the same time, around 1100 neo-Nazis marched through the city with torches.

Usually there is a major neo-Nazi demonstration to commemorate the bombing. This year on February 14th , about 6000 neo-Nazis – the highest number so far – from all over Europe came to march in Dresden. They listened to Wagner, symbolically laid down a wreath and carried placards saying: “allied bombing holocaust” and “historical truth brings intellectual freedom”. In their speeches they pointed out how the Allies “demolished an innocent city” and killed “hundreds of thousands of civilians”. In 2004 a commission of historians made clear that about 25000 people died during the bombings – far fewer than the number claimed by Nazi propaganda at the time and today’s neo-Nazis. It seemed necessary to highlight yet again how the city and its people were not that ‘innocent’: many of Dresden’s residents worked in war industries and the city was a communication and transportation hub.

A broad alliance of democratic institutions and individuals – among them the confederation of German trade unions and members of the Social Democratic, Green and Left Party- called ‘Geh Denken’ (‘Go think’) that engages against right-wing extremism in Dresden organised a counter-demonstration, which was attended by 7500 people. ‘Geh Denken’ opposes the ‘exploitation’ of the remembrance event by neo-Nazis, the “distortion of history” and wants to send a “democratic signal” against right-wing extremism."


But Rivero suggests nazi / anti-semitic graffiti at a synagogue in Dresden on the anniversary of Kristallnacht is "a hoax".


socrates said...

Someone tried to manipulate the WRH page at Sourcewatch. But someone else came in showing that Rivero is a holocaust denier and anti-semite.

And is Rivero still a weekly guest on Alex Jones' radio show? That makes Alex Jones a Jew hater too, even if he doesn't make it as blatantly obvious as Rivero.

I linked up a lot of your investigations with mine, as concerning Tinoire, Jeff Wells, BradBlog. There's that guy Wayne Madsen too. He was an early supporter of Tinoire's dive. He is well-known for spreading disinformation. And he just happens to be affiliated with Tinoire? He claims to be ex-NSA. Doesn't this feel like a disinformation racket, TLNL? We might not have paystubs, but tell the truth, doesn't this reek worse than idiotic grifting?

anti-semitic and Holocaust denial links

socrates said...

I copied and pasted a good post of yours from the other thread and cross-posted it at truth-about-kos.blogspot. You were eloquent. I think those of us who are too deep into these specialised topics can often be less effective at articulating bottom lines than an objective bystander. That's why I'm grateful to you for looking into that, Agent99 and Big Dan, Brett Kimberlin. Remember that dude who invited you over to my forum? Check this out. He has been co-opting my specialised slants, whether with Kimberlin and others and posting about them elsewhere. He has never linked to me or given me credit. This is the guy who was said to be me at the WRH Unofficial before your famout Rivero says it's about the oil thread came out. Anyway, now he is saying I am his cyberstalker. Crazy stuff. Basically a long time back he told me some sort of sob story. He also gave me the name of his alleged famous father. I think him and others have been trying to drive me insane over the last couple years. But it's cool now. I am over this. I did the best I could. I think I did a good service. Why would I have gotten attacked so much, if I hadn't? You wouldn't believe the nutty stuff that has circled around me. You've seen some of it. You were even put into part of it at the Unofficial WRH. Anyway, I am at peace with myself. These fockers did not succeed at driving me nuts. Too bad you are agnostic. Otherwise you too could derive some pleasure from the fact that people like Rivero will either be going to hell or reincarnated into pigs. :)

socrates said...

Hey TLNL, BradBlog has shown up again at The Guardian. I just registered but am waiting for the confirmation to show up at my email address. This is a good opportunity to let the british readers know the truth about Brad. If you run through his entries there, you will notice that he plays it nice and safe by avoiding putting up any of his easily debunked material, for example with the Michael Connell threatened by Karl Rove hoax or the Sibel Edmonds crap. Here's the link.

Fox News's faux news

socrates said...

I left a post at The Guardian. I also checked out the moderating rules, and there is one against attacking other posters and the authors. I don't think I broke that rule. I also made a strong effort to sound as diplomatic and fair as possible. I screenshot it just in case it is deleted.

I'm curious why Brad Friedman hasn't posted at The Guardian about Sibel Edmonds, Michael Connell, Clint Curtis, or other topics he has covered which would lend themselves to questioning his credentials as a journalist.

I am no fan of Fox News, so there's no disagreement here on that. But what I do take exception with is Brad's close association with Brett Kimberlin, widely known in Indiana as having been the Speedway Bomber.

On his blog, Brad often asks for financial contributions. He says he gets no foundation support, that he can only continue to provide his news coverage mostly due to individual contributions. However, Brad and Brett Kimberlin are co-founders of the Velvet Revolution. I would like to know how much VR has amassed in contributions from wealthy new age donors such as Lori Grace and Harriet Crosby to go along with all other donations.

One of VR's new campaigns is one purporting to fight against domestic terrorism. Wouldn't it be nice if a disclosure was made informing the public that Brett Kimberlin was convicted for setting bombs, one of which led to a man taking his own life?

The fact is that Brad has never addressed Brett Kimberlin's background. Some folks may find Kimberlin a familiar name. During the 1988 Presidential election season, he was the convicted felon who alleged he sold marijuana to Dan Quayle. Even that one is not passing the truth test. Brett Kimberlin wants the world to believe he is an exonerated, ex-political prisoner. This is the big story, not the obvious one that Fox News is part of a right wing propaganda network. A well-worn cliche is tell us something we don't know. Maybe Brad can disclose how much VR has made over the years and more about Brett Kimberlin.

socrates said...

I left another post. Both have been deleted. I made a modest blog entry about this at DaveFromQueens2.blogspot. Here are three screenshots. The first is the one I copied and pasted above. The second was from someone else. The third was my reply to that individual.

screenshot 1

screenshot 2

screenshot 3

the_last_name_left said...

That was a really good comment - and it got deleted! Odd.

I suppose it must fall under "personally attacking the writer".........?

that's a shame.....and a bit troubling. Why in hell should Brad Friedman enjoy such protection?

You might consider a letter to the editor - and mark it for publication (or not).

I wrote to the ADL asking them to confirm or deny their involvement with VR. No reply whatsoever. Great. Thanks.

I did get confirmation from their attorney that he was indeed their attorney. ie VRs. I haven't yet replied to him about the reasons why I asked.......and asking for his view on it. I wanted a reply from the ADL before replying......but's worth making the point to him about the deceptive use of ADL and the other Orgs they mention. I'll write him again soon.

the_last_name_left said...

(Their attorney = VR's attorney, whom somewhat famously submitted effort to debar Bushco's torture lawyers from Bar Association, or something.)

socrates said...

Hi TLNL, I think Comment Is Free is totally separate from The Guardian management. That's a hunch. Maybe I could try to contact the paper's ombudsman or others up the food chain.

O know exactly the lawyer you're talking about. I mentioned him in one of my forum posts, though I think I flubbed it up. He's a good guy, right? He went after BushCo lawyers trying to make torture legal?

If so, then he might be a good guy to get through to. I'm sure there are some good people getting snookered by Velvet Revolution. Just look at how Brad puts up only his most credible stuff in the Guardian. If he ever went near the other material, and there is a lot of it, he'd be exposed to a lot of people as being some sort of grifter. I'm not sure if I ever tried to explain to you the Michael Connell hoax. He was a Republican who did computer work for the Bush Admin, and the kooky astroturfers have tried to turn an unfortunate plane crash of his into some kind of Karl Rove hit job. Hey, I hate Karl Rove as much as anyone, but there is no proof that Michael Connell was going to spill any beans. That was the big scam put out by Brad, Brett, and Alexandrovna before Brad segued into the Sibel Edmonds mess.

There was some sort of lawsuit going on in Ohio brought forth by VR attorney Cliff Arnebeck. He used to support Republican Bob Dole. Maybe that's like Moulitsas supporting Reagan. Man, I was a lefty at 18 and never looked back. I find it dubious when people like him, Huffington, and Hitchens make 180 degree shifts in ideology. Brett Kimberlin made a sworn affidavit for that case. He says a source from the McCain campaign whistlblew something about Michael Connell being threatened or something by Rove. I'd have to track down the exact quote, so I can't vouch for what I just wrote. I actually just put together a new blgo entry and my brain is fried. I'm tired. I am happy that we are definitely on the same page. There are so few of us. Or there are a bunch of good, critical thinkers in the world, but we're scattered about. And the world is so complex. It can be difficult to put things together even within our specialised areas.

I don't expect you or anyone to pour through all the links I provide in my new entry, but I do think the general gist is easy to figure out. I stumbled across a new area, that of fake peace movements. It's actually not a new idea to me. I've seen it before with an example of someone named Carol Rosin. In short, it looks like it can be easily shown that the US government is involved in the fake promotion of peace. Picture a kinder gentler version of "regime change."

Fake Peace Activism Tied To The Military and CIA

I feel like I am finally reaping the benefits of getting over banging my head against the blogospheric wall. Now that I know for sure there is no way to express myself at the conventional places, for example with even The Guardian, I am more relaxed. It feels like we have truly gotten some very important stuff accomplished. The mysterious S. Boyle can be proud of us. :) '

socrates said...

TLNL, maybe you can help me figure something out concerning Rivero.

I was googling around and found this article by Curt Maynard concerning Mike Rivero and someone named Bill White.

Now sure there probably a million tidbits one could point out. Like how and Maynard have often been showcased by Rivero. Like how they are all easily proven to be anti-semites.

I tracked down Rivero's article. It alleged that Bill White outed himself as part of GIYUS.

But when I parsed what Rivero actually came up with, it makes me think Rivero was actually outing himself as some kind of tool, that he could very well be a co-worker of White, to go with Maynard, Rense, Jones, Tinoire, et al.

"Of course, Bill White's claim did not do much more than incite a great deal of laughter. But in their haste to get this message out, one of Bill's minions slipped up.

Rather than cut and paste the text of Bill's accusations, one of the members of Bill's blog, apparently to prove the story's source, screen captured Bill's article, posted it to various newsgroups and in doing so, let slip a rather interesting secret.

Here is that screen capture."

Rivero gave one link concerning "posted it to various newsgroups."

It is unavailable, but I found it through the wayback machine.

The screenshot isn't showing up. In Rivero's screenshot, there does appear to be the GIYUS icon. But I don't get how Rivero has proven that this poster has any connection to Bill White.

I don't think Rivero made it up. What I think is going on here is that this whole stunt, from Maynard to White to Sergg at the Something Awful forum to Rivero was a coordinated stunt. Bill White is meant to be outed as GIYUS, while Rivero is meant to get the credit. That's what this appears like to me.

Strangely enough or perhaps most likely an insidious move by Rivero was to link to a left leaning website called One People's Project for those who want more info on Bill White. I couldn't find that link.

Think about Tinoire. Think about how she has been all over the place ideologically. How does one go from being military intelligence to being a communist sympathiser? Why would a lefty like Tinoire be into Rivero and have considered voting for Ron Paul? Conversely, why would a right winger like Rivero be linking to a lefty website?

socrates said...

I think there is some very sophisticated disinfo being pumped out on the internet. I am finding it very difficult to put it all together. But it's kind of like that one post of yours concerning Markos Moulitsas and ideologues having trouble with hiding their internal inconsistencies. There are so few like us who go after this sort of thing. Just think about the little tidbits I have come up with concerning Friedman and Kimberlin. Nowhere else but by me have they been looked into. The two day question- How Kimberlin and Friedman hooked up. Finding new age heiress Lori Grace's connection was an exclusive by me, a nobody from Massachusetts. No one but else has put together the Agent99 Big Dan connections. No one else has really mentioned things you have come up with. Think about this. Reflect. Am I making sense here? I know a lot of the things we are trying to figure out must appear overwhelming to the readers. Tinoire claimed to be military intelligence. When I posted about that at the Rigorous Intuition dive and here and at my forum, I don't believe anyone else has ever done that before me. It really wasn't that difficult to find. I mean it kind of was. I probably found it only because I was interested in checking out Tinoire's internet history for those internal contradictions. Then whenever I try to get my finds out to lots of people, whether on her or Friedman or others, none of them ever deal with the content. It is turned out into me being mentally deranged.Think about how it took us a while to trust the other. The internet is a disgusting heap of propaganda and misdirections. Even when we find solid stuff, we can't even get that info out. Even The Guardian scrubbed what I felt was a solid post. It wasn't trolling. It's the truth. There's something very focked up about Brad Friedman and Kimberlin. And I tied Tinoire directly to Kimberlin's Velvet Revolution. She is tied to Rivero. Big Dan and Agent99 can be tied to Rivero. On and on and on. Sorry for rambling. It just feels like we have come up with great things, and I don't want to give up, even if I have cut back dramatically from investigating such things.

socrates said...

I'm googling around. I'm wondering why Curt Maynard also appears to go by the name Chris Womak. I find this area you delved into interesting, though I admit I never had the stomach to read too much of it. After sleeping on that post I wrote last night about Rivero and Bill White, I truly believe those two are in cahoots along with Maynard. I'm not saying they are GIYUS or Mossad or anything. I don't know what they are. They sure do reek of something bad. Maybe I'll find something more to post about before nodding off.

socrates said...


Besides Rivero astroturfing another lefty type into his side with Cindy Sheehan (right woos left?), I don't understand where his evidence is against Stormfront. Hey, maybe it is a hoax. But this page reeks like the one I found concerning Bill White. It seems like internal WRH propaganda, an idiotic ploy to make Mike appear as the fighter against cointelpro-like entities. Where is the proof that Stormfront is a corporation? That it says so in a whois form? And what's the big deal about its location being in Palm Beach, Florida?

socrates said...

Remember how you covered the Alex Jones versus Michelle Malkin thing? I found an entry where some dork claimed Alex Jones is a left wing conspiracy theorist. Thankfully, a bunch of people in the comments told the truth, that he is a right winger propagandist. Did you post on this thread? One of the comments sounded like you. Ok, I think I should get off the net. Take it easy.

Blogger Michelle Malkin Attacked in Denver near DNC08

socrates said...

TLNL, this dude Al from Narco News showed up at DFQ2. I think I done good. If you're into it, you might have an opportunity to ask a semi-famous/important internet journalist some questions. Or maybe he will run away liked a scared, little baby. I was in rare form in responding to him. :)

Fake Peace Activism Tied To The Military and CIA

the_last_name_left said...

Al Giordano? Narco news Network?

SFAIK he's cool. He took a few "liberal" US journos in venezuelans to task for posing as liberals whilst seemingly being close to the business/upper class elites and passing off disinfo against Chavez.

I haven't read your link yet, but I imagine he's a possible candidate to gain some interest and traction with.

On the other stuff - yes, Winston Smith was me at that Malkin/Jones post. I have quite a few posts about that issue - because Jones' bots were all over it - and it seemed a good opportunity to drop some it was a crossover point of the right (malkin), the patriot-right (jones), and the left (anarchists). Plus there was obviously a lot of confusion over Jones' politics. I spent a while finding areas where Jones and Malkin are politically close - and there's quite a few. Whereas he isn't close to the anarchists on anything much at all, really.

SO for him to call her "fascist" was a good opportunity to try to get some facts out about Jones' own REAL far-right connections.

Rivero's thing about Stormfront is weird, isn't it?

What does he think it proves? There's never been an issue over Stormfront being anywhere other than Florida - which is seemingly a nazi hotbed. And it is the home of Don nothing weird about that.

However, it is also the location of Rivero's "chums" from BankIndex - Mr James P Garib and his various companies. That's where some dude had cited was Rivero's address -- but Rivero claimed it was his brother's address? (The same as BankIndex! ie in Florida IIRC.)

I don't know what Rivero was trying to say with that useless page about Stormfront. It's odd - it doesn't seem to do anything.

It shows Rivero knows Stromfront........if nothing else.

He never mentions them otherwise, nor any of the other real nazis. Unless it is to point to arguments in their den - like over Bill White, which tend to show the leadership as potentially compromised, state-agents, betrayers, whatever.

I mean - who in their right mind really cares about internecine struggles of nazis? Would a conspiracy website audience be a natural place to post stories about Nazi leadership, betrayals, whatever? Hardly. And yet Rivero has often dished out stories on it.......

He must think his audience is interested? And yet......of what interest to his audience does he imagine it is? It isn't like attacking the Florida nazis is something WRH spends much energy upon - none in fact. So.......why do quarrels in the nazi/fascist movement even feature as a topic of news at WRH? Why is it of interest to Rivero? Why does he imagine it is of interest to his audience? It's not to rabidly denounce them all, that's for sure.

Ok - off to read you and Al.

the_last_name_left said...

Hmm. Interesting.


There's been plenty of reports about the US destablisation campaign in Venezuela........a lot of it leading back to presidential candidate John McCain, via IRI, NED, USAID, etc.

And Freedom House. Which is Peter Ackerman, seemingly close associate of Duvall.......seeming funder for Al Giordano and NarcoNews.

Crikey! I don't think that's a trail that can be simply shrugged off.

Here's a little bit about Freedom House, IRI, NED, USAID connections: is not well known that Freedom House is a major recipient of U.S. government funding—directly from USAID or through the government-funded NED.

Relying almost exclusively on government funding for its overseas operations, Freedom House says it works "directly with democratic reformers on the front lines in their own countries" in Central Asia, Central and Eastern Europe, the Middle East, Latin America, the former Soviet Union, and the Balkans. According to Freedom House, its overseas activity "acts as a catalyst for freedom by strengthening civil society, promoting open government, defending human rights, and facilitating the free flow of information."

With USAID funding, Freedom House sponsors a "Human Rights Defenders" program in Venezuela that it promotes as "facilitat[ing] the interaction of Venezuelan civil society with counterparts in Latin America to help them improve domestic human rights reporting and to expand protections for human rights." The "longer-term goal," says Freedom House, is "to assist groups who will strive to safeguard and improve the functioning of democratic institutions in Venezuela."

In May 2007, Eva Golinger, Venezuelan-American author of The Chávez Code and a prominent critic of U.S. aid programs in Venezuela, accused Freedom House and other U.S. organizations receiving U.S. government funding of orchestrating a "destabilization plan" (see, May 26, 2007). Golinger claimed Freedom House was designing a campaign of nonviolent resistance to the Chávez government.

---I looked into all this whilst arguing about Venezuelan coup and all that. There's a whole slew of interesting connections - an alphabet soup of those supposedly working "to enhance democracy" whilst being in the pay of groups led by people such as John "the socialist" McCain!

Might be worth me digging it up again..... :)

Anyway - see if I have this straight?

Al Giordano/Narco News have a revenue stream from the Paul Ackerman funded ICNC......

Ackerman is a major dude at Freedom House.....which has been accused of working to undermine Venezuela's Chavez regime through funding by US State Department, USAID, NED, IRI, etc.......the same nexus behind the dubious "colour revolutions" in Ukraine, Serbia etc.

Hmmm. Hardly paranoid to find that "interesting". :)

the_last_name_left said...

So........ok.....Giordano isn't denying the connections, he is just saying any money NarcoNews receives from such connections has no influence on what Giordano and NarcoNews write and publish?

Good defence - how in hell could anyone prove the money influenced Giordano and NArcoNews?

But it is hardly whiter-than-white, is it?

Whilst the money might come from the ICNC, which claims to receive no government funding etc, their money has all come from Ackerman whom is running around as chief of Freedom House which is funded by USAID, NED, etc.

Those are the hallmarks of a political money-laundering scheme - where the funding is "cleaned" via third parties.

This is the known tactic and method used by NED, USAID, IRI......

I'd ask him if he doesn't feel uncomfortable about it. It's surely the sort of thing NarcoNews would find interesting and somewhat questionable about not about NarcoNews?

socrates said...

Hi TLNL, thanks for your responses. It's getting late here, so I'm not sure how much if any more I can write tonight. The other thing is I have comments on moderation at DFQ2. But I will try my best to approve any posts as soon as possible. Wow, right when I think blogging has hit an all-time low for being useless, it picks up some mojo. You see, I get trolled quite a bit, and if I didn't moderate the posts, a bunch of nasty stuff would have been published. Anyway, I had nothing against Al. I don't even know much about all this schtuff. But I did see he is a fan of Daily Kos and he is funded by those blokes. I probably got a bit cute in saying he must be the third or fourth reader, but it was an easy softball for me to hit. I wrote that thread yesterday or the day before, something like that, and he was right on it. That is kind of funky. Also, I'm trying not to ramble as much, keep things tight like Hemingway. So I'll probably try to chip in shorter posts in the future.

socrates said...

A lot of your stuff here on Al could be copied and pasted for him. I'm willing to give him room to prove himself. I swear to God I am not a troll. I can get a bit feisty, I admit it. Your writing has been very good lately. Your reading comprehension skills are also remarkable. Nice one, Laddie.

the_last_name_left said...

earlier this year Al Giordano wrote about the 'new' Obama stance on Venezuela -

"This newly-stated respect for Venezuela's internal governance marks a clear break from previous US policy that regularly sought to meddle in the country's democratic affairs.

But semingly NarcoNews has a source of funding which is itself entirely provided by a bigwig in the same organisations which were accused of the "meddling in Venezuela's democratic affairs" which Giordano references.

There certainly seems to be potential for conflict of interest there.

And certainly a relevant one, considering Giordano's own subject matter. For example, this stuff about Eric Ekvall, and reporter Phil Gunson which I referred to earlier.

the_last_name_left said...

This is from some dude who wrote a book about use of agencies promoting democracy as being pro-capitalist fronts to maintain status quo, further imperialism, undermine democracy etc:

it explains the method and rationale..... but also clearly suggests why it's troublesome that Al Giordano should be getting funding from Freedom House connections.

US political intervention under the banner of “democracy promotion” is aimed at undermining authentic democracy, gaining control over popular movements for democratisation, keeping a lid on popular democracy movements, and limiting any change that may be brought about by mass democratisation movements so that the outcomes of democracy struggles do not threaten the elite order and integration into global capitalism.
If democracy means the power of the people, mass participation in the vital decisions of society, and democratic distribution of material and cultural resources, then democracy is a profound threat to global capitalist interests and must be mercilessly opposed and suppressed by US and transnational elites.
What is new about the strategy of “democracy promotion” is that this opposition and suppression is now conducted under the rhetorical banner of promoting democracy and through sophisticated new instruments and modalities of political intervention.

Many US organisations are involved in Venezuela -- including the National Endowment of Democracy and its sub-foundations, the International Republican Institute, the Centre for international Private Enterprise, and the AFL-CIO’s Solidarity Centre; the NDI and IRI have offices in Caracas. These groups -- along with the US Agency for International Development (USAID), and a private company on contract from USAID called Development Alternatives International -- are funding Venezuela’s political opposition.


socrates said...

The Rivero thing about exposing Bill White can only be understood if one goes to the Rivero link and the Maynard link from Rense. It all seemed to come together in the same day or two.

You point out how the whois for Stormfront doesn't explain anything but a cryptic innuendo of something is similar to his saying one of White's minions is a member of GIYUS. There's no there there. Rivero gives one link to the alleged White associate. The only screenshot I see with the GIYUS icon is on the WRH page.

Rivero's like a bunch of other internet characters who like to portray themselves as cointelpro busters. That's a label I have gotten shoved in my face too. Your point is well taken about how idiotic it is to purport having sussed out some neonazi battle within their own milieu. Now if Rivero had come up with concrete proof on anything, it would make sense. The key is probably that it dealt with Ron Paul, the internet sensation and darling of the so-called patriot movement. It's actually kind of surreal to read neonazis arguing that White must be a disinfo plant for making Paul look like one of them. To paraphrase, they were like we like Ron Paul, so none of us should let the world know that he is a neonazi sympathiser.

On the other hand, a guy like Alex Jones has been berated by Joo haters for not being more anti-Israel. I guess him being a regular buddy of Michael Rivero isn't good enough for them.

I didn't really go into making my new blog entry with the intent of focusing on Narc News. But it was kind of tough not to include him. If he is some kind of plant, then it shows how these confidence scripts are conducted. They are written in a way where it becomes very difficult to be devil's advocate and make swuch connections to Ackerman, Duvall, Woolsey, and Moulitsas. Then as you have shown, and some of the stuff I copied and pasted, this is a huge topic. It is one that perhaps is very difficult for the average reader to get a grasp on.


socrates said...

Just look at Moulitsas. He has portrayed himself as a leading progressive. There is next to nothing on his history. But then it slipped out that he respects the CIA and almost became a spy. Just that little opening made the difference. Al Giordano needs to come clean. This is a pivotal moment in his life. I am not turning this into drama. It is what it is. He's protraying himself and Narco News as being at the forefront of exposing the CIA. Yet one of Duvall's partners was the head of the CIA. An analogy could be with Friedman and Kimberlin, who are small potatoes compared to guys like Ackerman and then it gets into Chavez and the coloured revolution concept as a guise for continued imperialism. Yikes, I'm definitely rambling. But I'm saying Giordano could be Friedman while Ackerman would be Kimberlin. We will never see the big cheeses behind the productions show up on our humble blogs. We won't find them available at places like Huffington and the Guardian. But guys like Friedman and Giordano are there. Then there's that lower tier protecting Friedman like Agent99 and Big Dan. And then there are the few like us who are saying wait a minute. Anyway, I am willing to give Al Giordano the benefit of the doubt, but it's very difficult to do so now, not after what he wrote. I smell fear. He's acting like he's like Gandhi being a vegetarian who wears leather shoes, that he doesn't eat the meat, but he wants warm feet. If Giordano can't address these connections, if he can't be real and admit they must look dodgy on the surface, I'm not sure how anyone can trust his motives. Or maybe he is just protecting his career and is in some kind of self-enforced cognitive dissonance. Hey, we are at the low rung of the blogging pecking order, but we still take the time to be devil advocates of ourselves. I'd rather face the truth if I make a big blunder. It's not that easy, however to do so, when I get banned from so many places or trolled on and get isolated and have no one watching my back. But for real, I think the bulk of work people like us do must enable the objective reader to understand we aren't making stuff up, that we're not simply pulling lint out of our belly buttons. People can track down our links, check out screenshots, read our attempts at clarifying to the best of our abilities. I want to see that same effort out of Al from Narco News. If he's just going to pass me off as having two or three readers and I'm paranoid, well, he might as well have never written to my blog. (Uhm, lately, and probably from now on, I am belting out posts, so apologies in advance for typos, bad grammar, spelling, and mumbled thoughts when they occur.)

socrates said...

TLNL, if you could copy and paste these things and add it to the DFQ2 thread, it'd be appreciated. I can keep checking back to see if posts are in moderation. It's 3 am though, now, and I should get to bed. Though I see you have added more, and I find all this very interesting.

socrates said...

Or maybe I can copy and paste your writing tomorrow in a new thread. No problem. Whatever you want. Thanks for digging this stuff up. Have a good day. I really appreciate your efforts. It means a lot. You've made a real difference.

the_last_name_left said...

"Freedom House - the grandfather of neo-conservative 'democracy promoting' organisations"

it is not surprising that most of ICNC’s principals of nonviolence were trained within the heart of the military-industrial complex: ICNC Vice-chair Berel Rodal, was formerly Director-General of the Policy Secretariat in the Department of National Defence; ICNC Manager of Educational Initiatives, Dr. Maria J. Stephan, has worked “at the U.S. Department of Defense and with the international staff at NATO Headquarters in Brussels”; and Shaazka Beyerle (former vice-president turned Senior Advisor of ICNC), is a founding Vice President of the European Institute.

The European Institute’s most interesting affliates include: board member Dr R. Michael Gadbaw, who is a director of the NED/USIP funded Partners for Democratic Change; Director Emeriti, Robert B. Zoellick, who was a signatory of the January 26, 1998 Project for the New American Century letter sent to President Clinton; and Advisory Board member, Ambassador Robert E. Hunter, who is also Chairman of the Council for a Community of Democracies and acts as a Senior International Consultant to the largest arms manufacturer in the world, Lockheed Martin. [11]


the_last_name_left said...

NED - IRI - USAID - John McCain - Venezuela - "promoting democracy"

I have a load of stuff on ties between NED and IRI backed groups leading right up to Carmona who was installed as "president" in the Ven coup.

I don't remember Ackerman or Duvall showing up in it, but, how far away from it can they be? Everything suggests they would be wrapped up in....and Al Giordano is taking money from them (sometimes?).


Hey, thanks for compliments btw.

the_last_name_left said...

i was reminded of something whilst looking for old stuff on this --

isn't it amazing that all these groups (promoting "capitalism" and "freemarkets" and US imperialism etc) are all funded by the US taxpayer?


they might at least pay for capitalist agitation out of their own money rather than bilking the state and taxpayers for it!

They charge the taxpayer for funds so that they can roll-back the state? y - right. Nothing wrong in state subsidies for rightwing pressure groups......? lol

socrates said...

There was some kind of glitch going on with the comments at DFQ2. But I think it's now solved, knock on wood. What I'll do is copy and paste your material and anything else you come up with to a new entry. I'll put up Al's comment and my response. I want to make sure Giordano doesn't get away with his shallow cover story. If he can't at least admit it looks bad, how can he be trusted? It'd be like if Obama had been accepting contributions from Karl Rove and other Republicans. Or if a group formed to fight domestic terrorism was started by someone who had set bombs leading to a man's suicide. Oh, wait a second. Yikers. Or Crikey. Or whatever the word is.

socrates said...

I've got a new entry up with your posts as the main feature. Thanks for helping out. This can turn into a lot of work when we are on our own. For that reason, that is why I am always willing to check into some of your interests. It takes a socialist village.

socrates said...

TLNL, I found some more bullshite coming out of Rivero. Yeah, I know, that's not too difficult to find. The thing is I'm having trouble finding anything about the following crazy tidbit other than from a Jew hate site named judicial Inc Biz. Rivero claims that the American Nazi Party was sponsored by the ADL. He should have called them the German American Bund. Perhaps this mistake was a deliberate one meant to sow further confusion. I can come to no other conclusion than that this link is the basis by which he made the outrageous claim. It appears that the American Nazi Party and The German American Bund were two separate groups.

Fake Al Qaeda Actors EXPOSED! Adam Gadahn & Yousef al-Khattab

(partial transcript excerpt from around the 48 second mark)

Michael Rivero: ...and if you've been following the history of the Anti-Defamation League, you will find out they've been very much involved with covertly supporting a lot of these so-called American Nazi movements. In fact, all the way back just about the time of WW2, there was this scandal where the head of the American Nazi Party, which had a total membership of like six, and yet they were getting all this press. Uhm, [Kuhn] was arrested for embezzling from his sponsors, which turned out to be the ADL. So that kind of blew up in their faces.

The comments at youtube, by the way, are disgusting. Good guys are getting their comments rated into oblivion, while the neo-nazi ones are being recommended.

The crap spewed here seems to go beyond any "sincere" hatred of Jews and seems to be pure, unadulterated, disinfo crap. Michael Rivero to me is beyond being a grifter making money off of stupid conspiracy theories. I believe he is the epitome of a disinfo agent.

the_last_name_left said...

typical Rivero, yeah.

The ADL paid for the whole G/A Bund thing?

because says so?

Funny, really. What's he trying to say? That there's no such thing as anti-semitism, really? It's all dreamt-up by the ultimate benefit of jews?

One need be anti-semitic to believe such bullshit? And by that fact alone, one disproves the idea that jews are responsible for fostering ALL anti-semitism.

Is Rivero's anti-semitism paid for by Jews, then? Is that what he's saying? Are the ADL sponsoring Rivero? Doubtful - so what the hell is he saying when he implies all anti-semitism is fostered by jews themselves?

The only reference I can find to his claim is that Judicial Inc thing - which is just repeated a few times across the internet. It isn't sourced or's just a claim. And just a claim - meaning what?

And again -- how come Rivero "knows" this stuff about the history of the american far-right and its dalliances with nazism? It's obscure stuff, really.......what's his interest in it? It isn't an interest in history of anti-semitism that motivates him, obviously, as he denies it exists.

And if, as Rivero suggests, nazi hate-crimes of today against jews are all hoaxes, then what's his interest? Is the issue for Rivero that the poor lovely people of the far-right are being unfairly portrayed as violent and homicidal jew-haters? Well, damn those bugger Jews! They're falsely characterising Nazis!!

How ridiculous? And how offensive!

It's nazi apologia - and it casts jew as scheming, two-faced perpetrators of attacks upon themselves. It suggests Jews are actually responsible for the bad 'rep' of nazis.....and are masters of deception, subversion etc etc. All the usual time-worn themes of anti-semitism - all wrought into a scheme which exonerates the far-right of responsibilty and reprehensibility.

despicable, imo.

socrates said...

I thought you'd appreciate that one.

It's actually mind blowing that Judicial Inc Biz doesn't even try to document their claim with anything.

Your point is brilliant that this is obscure stuff, and how it's strange that Rivero is able to track this type of nonsense down.

Also, I tried with no luck to find Rivero astroturfing such a claim on the internet, at his website, or anywhere else from whatever radio show he was on spreading this ADL funded the German-American Bund meme. For the Bill White thing, he advised folks to go to the left wing One People's project. He didn't mention Judicial Inc Biz. It's like he is presenting different sources for different folks. Right woos left stuff he delivers One's People's Project. For the neonazis, he used to give them Maynard. I'm curious if Rivero has ever linked to Judicial Inc Biz. I know he has linked to Rense. He has published Maynard.

Something else I'd be curious about is if he has discussed the "Israel problem" when he's been on with Alex Jones. You have shown how Alex uses code to mask his own form of Jewish gloabl conspiracy theory. Maybe another way to unmask Jones' anti-semitism would be through his interactions with Rivero. It would be strange if they never discussed it. If Jones has been trying to hide his participation with the Joos Own the World thing, then that would be a tell. Either way. If he and Rivero never discuss Israel, that would tell us something. If they discuss it, then it'd be interesting to see what was mentioned. E.G. Were the embarrassing holocaust denial and Maynard Rivero stuff avoided? My line of thinking here is similar to how Brad Friedman doesn't mention Sibel Edmonds or his more outrageous Kimberlin affiliated stuff at the Guardian's Comment is Free. Maybe it is in what isn't said that can be as informative as is what is discussed. A perusal through Rivero and Jones together on the radio may offer some answers for you. Maybe if I get the time, I'll try to check into this.

socrates said...

I checked out a bit at youtube with Rivero being interviewed by Jones. They do cover Israel, but Rivero seems to be on his best behaviour. It's a headache to listen to. It'd be nice to be able to tie Jones in directly with the anti-semitism that Rivero spews and supports, such as in the the Judicial Inc Biz crap that Rivero spewed about apparently on his own show. Great points TLNL. It's perhaps analogous to the Narco News thing, where if these people were consistent, they'd have to investigate themselves. So yes, if the Joos are behind all this anti-semitism, then does that mean Rivero works for Mossad? Fock them all and the disinfo shite they peddle. We have won, and they have lost. Rivero has been caught in bed with Judicial Inc Biz. He doesn't even have the balls to write it up so people can read what he said on a radio show. He's a clever focker in his own mind. Who does Rivero really work for? Another shitehead named Hal Turner has been working for the FBI. Is that who Rivero works for too?

I'm trying to find if Rivero ever linked to Turner. Here's a link Rivero put up to Curtis Maynard.

Maynard: Told You So. And I Told You Over Several Years - Hal Turner is a Snitch

Bear in mind that Apollonian, the dumb ass extraordinaiire defended this piece of shit for the entire time I condemned him. Hal Turner is, was, and has always been an FBI snitch period. His actions betrayed him long ago, but most of you never paid any attention. Bill White, alleged uber Nazi and Alex Linder [Webmaster of VNN and VNNforum] are also snitches and informants, and you can take that to the bank. This cunting bastard Turner was the one behind having my first blog the Politically Correct Apostate shut down.

You may not like me, but Curt Maynard does NOT lie....

You've done very good work to tie Rivero to anti-semitism. He is trying to make a distinction between his anti-zionism with anti-semitism. The more it can be shown that he has been in bed with Joo haters and holocaust deniers, the more it can be seen he is a disinfo peddler. That youtube video is enough proof for me. Wow. Mike Rivero is claiming that the ADL sponsored the German-American Bund. What an asshat fake who has been taken to the cleaners by nobodies. Well-played, friend.

socrates said...

Curtis Maynard, a close associate of Michael Rivero, admitted he is a holocaust denier.

In the comments, someone copied and pasted Rivero admitting the same thing. But when I google that, the only link that shows up is Maynard's. Rivero appears to be trying to cover up his blatant Joo hate. Alex Jones has him on his show every month. That makes Alex Jones part and parcel of lies spread about Jews and the Holocaust.

socrates said...

I'm on a roll.

Here's a mysterious S. Boyle blast from the past showcasing Rivero's less than stellar research skills and his association to things that just aren't true.

Here's a copy of paste of the Rivero's article titled, The Holocaust: Give us the Facts! Warning- that will take you to where it's said that, "Mike Rivero of is a good friend of mine and a clear-headed, helpful patriot."

Here's also a post made by Sword_Of_Truth at the Randi forum. I'm not a big fan of those guys, nothing personal TLNL, but this quote is a good one. "lol. As a weird type of connection, Mike Rivero, who runs, did the special effects on that film. I was under the impression that those who spread Holocaust denial have a tough time finding work in Hollywood?

DISCLAIMER: I am not implying that joooos control Hollywood. Holocaust deniers are a special kind of scum that are offensive even to Hollywooders."

That's kind of the same logic you used and I agree with of how Rivero (and Giordano)needs to investigate himself!

Here's some Chris Cornell and audioslave for those who'd like to forget about Rivero for a while. Michael Rivero is definitely creepy!

The last Remaining Light
I Am the Highway

socrates said...

I have spread the truth about Kos at OpenLeft. This is one of those we'll have to wait and see if it is censored. I haven't a clue. I do know that this Chris Bowers dude who seems to run Open Left banned Francis Holland from MyDD for exposing Daily Kos. So who knows. I have had this account for a while, but this was my first post. Ironically, I found out about this diary on bannings through a historic troll known as DavidByron, who word has it is the most banned poster in blogosphere history. That's usually going to be the case for sexist "progressives" who call for the destruction of Israel.

Here's the problem

screenshot 1
screenshot 2

the_last_name_left said...

I am sure I have written about that snippet of holocaust denial from Rivero. But I can't find it......

Anyway......yes, he often indulges holocaust denial.

Most annoying is his cleverly denialist assertion that "we need a reliable, honest investigation".

Sorry Mr Rivero - but the wwhole point is WE ALREADY HAVE THEM - OVER AND OVER AND OVER.

He has several themes to his denial - one being a claim that the Red Cross never mentioned the extermination of the jews. Well, they did, as Lipstadt has shown, for example.

He also joins the stupid contorted chorus claim that "investigation of the holocaust is forbidden". The reverse is more true - one can repeat the most outrageous denialist lies with impunity -- and even make a living out of it, right Mr Rivero?

And why are all the deniers from the far-right?

Because holocaust denial's goal is to rehabilitate and exonerate Nazism of its most famous crimes whilst simultaneously accusing Jews of committing a tastless, cynical mass hoax to exploit people of goodwill everywhere.

Another dumb thing Rivero does - argue that people should "get over" the past ie the holocaust, nazism, slavery, racism, the Klan etc.

Somehow it doesn't stop him promoting holocaust denial though. Somehow that isn't "trawling over the past".....

Just like the foundation of the Fed Reserve - that isn't "old news" either, somehow.

Then he has the nerve to pretend to be upset and surprised at being accused of anti-semitism!

Funny - though he addresses criticisms of anti-semitism (he just denies it) he never has addressed the criticisms of his being far-right and closely connected to organised fascism. He seemingly won't touch the issue.

socrates said...

The beauty of going after Rivero is that the heavy lifting has already been done. He couldn't, even if he desired, delete all traces of his Joo hate and right wing blatherings.

I busted him once showing how in his letters he published someone using Red Cross or whatever suspect data to promote holocaust denial. I wonder what ever happened to the mysterious S. Boyle. Wouldn't it be exciting if he or she showed up here?

You're quite correct he goes nowhere near the fact that he is tied into the neo-fascist tinfoil network with people like Alex Jones. You've made the point before how people like that astroturf that there is no difference between left and right all the while they are clearly on the far right. Rivero will never recover from his ties to Willis Carto. Perhaps that's why I mentioned S. Boyle. That cat did some great work.

Also, you make a great point about how the Joo haters like to spew propaganda about the Holocaust not meaning that much or even that the numbers of Jewish people actually murdered is in question. It'd be one thing if the argument was that 5 million died instead of six or something like that, but those dudes take it too far. I have a screenshot somewhere of Rivero publishing the idea that the Jewish population in Europe and/or Germany actually increased. That's Holocaust denial. Zundel considers Michael Rivero his friend. I don't doubt it. Those attacking Israel's right to existence like to use their holocaust denial as an argument to question its right to exist as a sovereign nation. While I do have major issues with Israel trampling on Palestinians' rights, the creation of Israel was a necessity considering the holocaust. A lot of land Israel won also took place after they were initially attacked. I think there could be a two state solution. Israel could give back some land to the pre-war borders and perhaps some more. Surrounding Arab nations could cough up a bit of their land. I am no expert, and I may be an idealist, but I think there can be long lasting peace in the Middle East. What I am sure of is that people like Michael Rivero are the Palestinians' worst enemies. They almost make it seem that Israel isn't doing much wrong but are in survival mode.